Poll: Is this usage of combat modifier valid?
You do not have permission to vote in this poll.
No, this is illegal
84.00%
21 84.00%
Yes, this is legal
16.00%
4 16.00%
Total 25 vote(s) 100%
* You voted for this item. [Show Results]

Thread Rating:
  • 1 Vote(s) - 5 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
[Rules] 6.42 Firepower Enhancement
03-02-2023, 09:15 AM,
#10
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement
(03-02-2023, 01:10 AM)Shad Wrote:
(03-02-2023, 12:52 AM)cjsiam Wrote: One of the things being missed (me thinks) is that Activation is either "Activated to MOVE" or "Activated to FIRE" --- there is no just "ACTIVATED" State.
So when it says the Leader must be activated to contribute his fire modifier---that MEANS he has to be Activated to FIRE

What's missing is what you just said being anywhere in the rules as written Big Grin  6.42 has no requirement for type of activation.

On the contrary, Rule 14.4 for assisting morale recovery is explicit:
14.4 Recovery
Only a successful recovery attempt can repair the degraded morale status of a unit or leader. When players attempt to improve the morale status of their demoralized and disrupted units it is called "recovery." Units may recover with the assistance of an activated leader, or on their own. Units attempting recovery and leaders assisting them must be activated and may conduct no other action that turn. Place a Moved/Fired marker on any unit that attempts recovery (whether it is successful or not), and any leader who assists a recovery attempt.

This explicit wording in 14.4 and the absence of same in 6.42 is ... Angel

Interesting----But....(emphasis mine..Italics are RAW text.)
3.12 Leaders and Activation...
A leader may only activate units at the beginning of his activation (he may not move and then activate units he was not with or adjacent to before moving).

3.13 Unit Actions
The activated unit, leader or group performs actions in no specific order, but all actions must be designated before the first is performed. Actions are either Movement or Fire.

Thus a unit, including a leader, will be activated with EITHER a MOVE or a FIRE Activation....he is not "just activated" he is Activated with ONE or the OTHER.
Quote:("What's missing is what you just said being anywhere in the rules as written Big Grin  6.42 has no requirement for type of activation.")
....That would not seem to be the case...3.13 is explicit---one or the other ... it is binary (even in this day and age....) you are either Activated to Move, or Activated to Fire...


Players need not pre-designate directions or targets - they just state which units will move and which will fire this action segment.

Your example discussed here specifically contradicts this stricture.....the leader is activated to Move into the hex...(he is then marked Move/Fired--or in vassal "Activated"--and he's done)
 
"Movement" includes moving (5.0), digging in (16.2), limbering/unlimbering (5.63) or attempting to recover morale (14.4). "Fire" includes direct fire (10.0), bombardment (9.0), anti-tank fire (11.0) and assault (12.0, even though initiating or joining an assault involves moving into the assault hex).
Once units are done moving and firing, mark them with Moved/Fired markers.

Recall the earlier specification that each UNIT is moved INDIVIDUALLY---thus the leader, at the conclusion of his movement, is marked with Moved/Fired marker(or Activated
in VASSAL)..

Units marked with Moved/Fired markers may not activate again in the current turn except through Random Events (see Optional Rules).

6.2 Leader ActivationA leader may only be activated if it is not currently marked with a Moved/Fired marker. A leader with a Moved/Fired marker may assist friendly units undergoing morale checks (14.1) or defending against an assault (12.4), but may not activate friendly units (3.1), assist recovering units (14.4), or initiate an assault (12.11).

It does not say "assist with Direct Fire".....

6.42 Firepower Enhancement
An activated, undemoralized leader may add his combat modifier to the direct fire value of one unit in his own hex. 

THUS:
At the conclusion of his move into the hex--the leader is marked with a Moved/Fired Marker (Activated in VASSAL) (3.13 above)...
He may NOT ACTIVATE AGAIN (last phrase in 3.13) "Units marked with Moved/Fired markers may not activate again in the current turn"
6.42-Firepower Enhancement requires the leader to be activated (and I see the rules say with a FIRE Activation)--BUT as per 3.13---he is NOT activated
at this time---he is marked with a Moved/Fired marker...his MOVE activation is over, was over, when he moved into the hex and was marked.

So---
Leader is activated to MOVE, INF is activated to FIRE---at the beginning of the Activation Segment.
The Leader is moved one hex.....HE IS THEN MARKED WITH Moved/Fired Marker(Activated in Vassal).....
The INF wants to fire.....he was activated to Fire....but the LEADER is marked with marker already, and was previously activated to ONLY MOVE
---as he has completed his movement...thus he cannot do anything OTHER then what is allowed in 6.2 

Q.E.D. Winking
or so it would seem to me
joe_oppenheimer and Michael Murphy like this post
Reply


Messages In This Thread
6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by Shad - 03-01-2023, 01:58 PM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by goosebrown - 03-01-2023, 03:58 PM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by Blackcloud6 - 03-01-2023, 10:50 PM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by Shad - 03-01-2023, 11:54 PM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by Blackcloud6 - 03-02-2023, 01:39 PM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by Shad - 03-02-2023, 12:32 AM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by plloyd1010 - 03-02-2023, 12:42 AM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by cjsiam - 03-02-2023, 12:52 AM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by Shad - 03-02-2023, 01:10 AM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by cjsiam - 03-02-2023, 09:15 AM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by Shad - 03-02-2023, 10:36 AM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by cjsiam - 03-02-2023, 12:57 PM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by Shad - 03-02-2023, 01:30 PM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by cjsiam - 03-02-2023, 02:36 PM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by plloyd1010 - 03-03-2023, 01:48 AM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by Shad - 03-03-2023, 12:46 AM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by goosebrown - 03-03-2023, 01:15 AM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by cjsiam - 03-03-2023, 11:19 AM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by cjsiam - 03-03-2023, 03:17 PM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by cjsiam - 03-04-2023, 02:30 PM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by cjsiam - 03-04-2023, 07:58 PM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by Blackcloud6 - 03-05-2023, 12:56 AM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by Sonora - 03-05-2023, 04:32 AM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by cjsiam - 03-05-2023, 11:26 AM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by Miguelibal - 03-05-2023, 02:10 PM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by cjsiam - 03-05-2023, 11:28 AM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by Blackcloud6 - 03-05-2023, 10:40 PM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by plloyd1010 - 03-06-2023, 09:40 AM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by goosebrown - 03-11-2023, 12:30 AM
RE: 6.42 Firepower Enhancement - by cjsiam - 03-11-2023, 03:56 PM

Forum Jump:


Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)